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 Barb  |
I played C1 for he first few days and did ok with it but now I am trying to learn C3/DS. The first Norn died at 90 mins, his life force slipped away, I tried everything to get him to eat but he was not interested, just wanted to sleep all the time. I dropped the medical bug thing on him which kept telling me he was healthy. When he started sneezing I tried to get him from the DS Meso to the medical bay but he died on the way there. I started again, this time focused on teaching him to eat. His life force went into the 20s before I could get him to eat well enough to get it up in the 30s. I hatched a mate for him, same issue. I spend *all* my time just getting them to eat, all three food groups. As soon as I turn my attention to anything else they stop eating and the life force number starts falling again. The female, Reba, likes to go out the hatch into the bridge. I struggle to get her back in because there is no food out there. I have added agents to stop grendels and ettins from hatching at least until I can manage the norns. I installed the Infirmary, works great but I have to reinstall it every time I open the game. They have one offspring who I put in export because I had the same problem with eating. I put their next two eggs in inventory until I am better prepared to handle this. So, questions are: --is it normal to have such a struggle to get them to eat? I plead and beg them to eat food, tickle reward when they do. --The only way I can find to monitor their life force number is the little hud that installs with C12DS. Is there any other way to easily monitor this? (I dont much care for the medical bug thing, it gets in the way and I can't read their talk.) --Is there anything else I can do besides beg them to eat to get their life force up to normal? |
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 Zweitausend |
Usually, C3/DS creatures should be smart enough to eat on their own. I never had a norn starve to death if there was food around, unless s/he wanted to eat the elevator, door, norn home etc. instead. Do you play with the original genome? You might want to consider trying out the CFE/CFEm genome or maybe the Gizmo norns instead. The former seems definitely somewhat smarter overall and the Gizmos are simply fun to play around with, they're much more lifelike since they can't go hours without food and actually seem to learn on their own. |
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 Malkin Manager  |
You might like the Medical Monitor by emmental - it adds a 'drawer' to the left hand side of your screen (like the inventory drawer on the right hand side) which regularly scans your norns for bacteria and disease. The C12DS 'life force' monitor doesn't correlate with the C1 life force monitor. My TCR Norns |
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Barb |
I had read that too, that C3DS Norns did not need as much coaxing to learn to eat. The male is Bengal and the female is Chichi, both breeds C3DS, right? I don't understand why I am having such a struggle with this. The C1 norns were much easier in this respect, and their was a popup to monitor lifeforce. I don't really feel confident about messing with genomes yet. Thanks, I will go check out the medical monitor, that may be what I need. |
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 KittyTikara |
Everyone ninja'd my other answers while I was adding images, but I'll second the CFE Norns and the medical monitor, both of them are useful. Another monitor I'd recommend is the X-ray. It's a bit complicated but it's super useful. The organ view is the default view on it, and it shows the lifeforce of the currently selected Norn's organs. If you click the green beaker button, it expands and tells you all sorts of things about what's going on in a Norn. If you just want to know it's current needs, press the green-face button and it will tell you a Norn's current drive levels. It also folds away like the medical monitor does, so it doesn't get in your way. The Mobula Ray - My Creatures blog |
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Barb |
If the C12DS 'life force' monitor doesn't correlate with the C1 life force monitor, does that readout have any meaning? Am I making myself nuts for nothing lol? I installed the medical moniitor but it is not showing up. Is it only for DS? I also installed the Infirmary which was a big help but it disappears every time I reopen the game. Kitty posted while I was typing this. I will go try the x-ray one. |
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Zweitausend |
Are you using C3 standalone or a docked world? I'm not sure about the former, but the latter definitely works. |
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KittyTikara |
I usually just ignore the life force monitor in C1toDs and my Norns do fine. I figure as long as a Norn isn't hungry or diseased, whatever that monitor says really doesn't matter. Plus I think the chemical that the life force monitor, monitors has changed from game to game. Also what do you mean the Infirmary keeps disappearing? Does the whole metaroom disappear, or just the favorites icon? The Mobula Ray - My Creatures blog |
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 Peppery One Papriko |
A small sidenote: you mentioned that getting norns from A to B was slow. You know you can hold shift and right click to pick 'em up? Scrolling the mouse wheel switches between rooms, at least in DS. Lets play plants! Photosynthesis... Photosynthesis... Photosynthesis... |
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 FlyingEttiNorn |
yes! i knew the c1 life force thing was wrong, because even my healthiest norns were at 20-30% life force! anyway, try injecting him with food in the medical bay, or download a bunch of agents, get every kind of food type in the game (fruit, seed, food, bug, critter, potion, leaf) and see if he eats at least one of those? |
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 Lollipop Lord C-Rex |
I know this may seem obvious, but did you remember to teach your Norns their vocabulary? |
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Barb |
@Zweit: I am using a docked world. Neither the medical monitor or the x-ray are showing up. @Kitty: It is the favorites icon at the top that disappears. Maybe the room is still there. Is there another way to get to it? It has a function for having a Norn in the room, not sure how to get one in there. I will go back and reread the readme file for it. @Papriko: I did not know about shift-rt-click pickup, that is very helpful. I tried to educate myself as much as possible before I started playing but the urge to get in there took over. :-) I noticed by accident that the scroll wheel changes rooms. I was finding it annoying but I can see where it is useful if I can pick up a creature and move. @Flying: yes I realize now that the LF monitor that was freaking me out was not accurate. I removed it from my screen. @C-Rex: yes they learned their vocab early. In fact the male loves the one in the meso, he keeps going back there and turning it on, big grin on his face when it pulls him up into the vortex. So I turned off that old LF monitor and just played, much more relaxed gameplay. They have a son and three more eggs in my inventory. Not sure why some of those medical monitors are not showing up, I will doublecheck that I installed properly. Thanks for all the helps. |
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KittyTikara |
Have you installed the remastered patch? If you haven't I'd install it and see if the x-ray shows up. Also your right, the Infirmary does loose it's favorite icon when you reload the game. You can still get to it by using a door that's near the Ettin and Grendel terrarium doors. The Mobula Ray - My Creatures blog |
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Barb |
Thanks, Kitty, I found the door! Doh on me, should have looked there. Someday I might make a webpage with a title something like Things I Wish I Had Known To Begin With. I will go check out the patch. I have Exodus, I figured it would be patched but will go see. |
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Barb |
If the patch was included in Exodus and I install the one you recommended, will it break my game or no big deal? |
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 Tea Queen Laura |
You needn't worry: the Creatures Remastered Patch is a third-party addon, so it won't already be included in your Exodus installation.  |
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 Espeon_DS |
Norns usually eat by themselves. If they're refusing to eat then they've probably got a severe genetic problem. Or you might not have the latest genomes/patches installed. It's usually on Creatures 2 you find Norns refusing to eat. On Creatures 3 it's not usually a problem. "If you're not the one, then why does my soul feel glad today?" |
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 Code Monkey evolnemesis |
About the x-ray, I just installed it and I had the same problem finding it... I figured it out though, and it might be the same problem for the other agent you mentioned... Not sure if this is your problem, but the agent injector in the engineering section of my C3 Shee Ark will not show the xray at all, (I guess it's not compatible with just base C3, or maybe it's just because of which 'My Agents' folder I put it in...) Anyway, I put the .agent file into 'My Agents' in my DS install folder, then used the agent injector in the DS capillata, It's in the comms room, and the x-ray will show up at the end of the list of the agents. If you get an error injecting it, you may also have to copy the 'xray.catalogue' file (which the game extracts out of the .agent file the first time you try to inject it) from the 'My Documents/Creatures/Docking Station/Catalogues' folder into the 'Catalogues' folder in your Docking Station install folder. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
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Barb |
Reporting back after a few days of gameplay ignoring the C12DS toolbar: all subsequent Norns are eating just fine. Maybe my first one just had some genetic problem. I cannot find a way to remove the c12ds toolbar from my screen, though. I can put it in inventory but it is in the way of everything else. I tried the remover functions in both C3 and DS injectors with no luck. Some other issues I am finding: Some of my Norns are frequently shivering, yet all indicators show that they are healthy (I used hoverdoc and the infirmary). I installed a heater agent, which does not seem to help. I installed the hot cocoa giver which did not help the shivering but they loved to push the button. I quickly had about 30 mugs that would not go away and would not recycle, had to collect them and send them out the airlock. I thought about messing with the bio controls but concerned that if I turned up the heat it would upset the ecology. Other than that they seem to be thriving because I am up to my neck in eggs and they often report being happy. Thanks for the tip on xray, evol, will go try that. |
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Malkin Manager |
Sometimes norns just get a little cold as they use lifts, etc. Norns don't naturally eat the hot cocoa, you have to tell them to 'eat potion'. My TCR Norns |
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Barb |
ahh, i was just saying drink. will try again. thx |
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Peppery One Papriko |
Potion? I always thought it is "elixir"... Lets play plants! Photosynthesis... Photosynthesis... Photosynthesis... |
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Malkin Manager |
In the English version of the game, it is 'potion'. My TCR Norns |
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Code Monkey evolnemesis |
I like to use the ? hand feature and left click on an object, it has the hand say the word for the norns, and, after a few repetitions, teaches all norns in earshot that word, but the cool thing is that each click also brings their attention to that object somewhat... Like if i do this on the dispenser, not only do the norns around repeat the word 'dispenser' and learn it, one often decides to go push it after i click on it a few times, because hearing the word gets him thinking about things he could try with the dispenser. I sometimes do this to get a baby who can't talk interested in the machinery in the meso that teaches them language. just teach them the word 'machinery', pointing at the machine, and they often can't resist touching it... I also try it if I'm not sure what classification something is or the word for it. Pretty sure it works decently for potions too, it should get their attention, but they won't know what to do with them really, they might just look at them or try random stuff, they might just pick it up, drop it, so on, unless you tell them to eat it. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
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 Patient Pirate ylukyun Manager |
evolnemesis wrote: Yep. I find this also works well for power-ups and knowledge stones. |
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Code Monkey evolnemesis |
Also, about the norns shivering, little known fact, norns urinate, and often when you see them shivering for no reason, it's from that (They get the pee shivers, urinating adds a decent amount of coldness to them, so if they aren't already feeling hot, then they will shiver when they go). Using lifts and other things can add minor amounts of coldness too, like a little draft, but unless they are sick, the most common reason for shivering by far is that they are going to the bathroom. You'll notice they do it more if they have munched on a lot of protein, because the byproducts of digesting protein are what get processed in the norn's kidneys and eventually dealt with that way. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
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Barb |
Wow, evolnemesis, that's interesting. Glad to know I don't have to panic every time it happens, and also glad I don't have to clean up after them. |
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Zweitausend |
And here I was, wondering why my norns keep shivering and being visibly cold. I can see why that's the case with ettins, what with the desert being their home, but I never quite understood why norns and grendels frequently tremble without any indication as to why they suddenly got cold. Thank you for clarifying that. |
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Code Monkey evolnemesis |
Barb wrote: Lol, yeah if you could have a real one as a pet, you'd learn to hate that shivering sound pretty fast probably, lol... If you hear that coming from the living room, you know it's probably time to run for the mop... They really have no control over when they go (no! not in the garden!) At least their bodies do seem to fully metabolize and process all fat and starch/cellulose, so they don't have to get rid of solid waste.If you have the x-ray, you can see the source of the coldness, by watching chemicals 25(urea), 113(pistle), and 152(coldness), when urea builds up to a certain point, they release pistle, which essentially is a hormone that just makes them go, and you will see the urea and pistle drop all the way down, their coldness spikes up, then urea starts slowly building up again... it will start to level off if they don't eat protein for a while, and that can make it take a long time for them to go again, but as long as they are eating protein regularly (and their kidneys work, and they aren't dehydrated), you will see urea keep building and this cycle repeating... they won't shiver every time, but you will notice when they do, it usually coincides with the coldness spike from this reaction. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
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Code Monkey evolnemesis |
Zweitausend wrote: Yep, it's just one of a few reasons really, as someone else said, they get a little cold just walking around, using lifts, etc... the effect is pretty minor though, like a pleasant breeze; but urination is part of how water cools them (besides sweating and panting, both of which they do if they get hot, but those won't make them shiver because they reduce hotness but don't add coldness), and it's one of the most efficient cooling methods they have, so it often can cause shivering if they aren't really cold... just like real animals. It's amazing how much biological detail is in these little creatures. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
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