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 Malkin   Manager  |
 Arnout has recently released a series of genetic breeds based on the Creatures Full of Fixes version 1.1 by evolnemesis, the 2017 Creatures!The amount of hunger the 2017 Creatures gain is determined by the amounts of nutrients in their bodies. In the half-life gene, each of these 3 chemicals decay naturally. The 2017 Creatures have a different way to measure muscle activity and can store muscle tissue. Vanilla Creatures had a tendency to eat a lot of food and store a lot of adipose tissue. The 2017 Creatures aren't as likely to prefer food as their predecessors. DOWNLOAD THEM HERE: 2017 ChiChi Norns 2017 Bengal, Bruin, Civet, and Magma Norns 2017 Astro, Bondi, Fallow, Hardman, Harlequin, Siamese, Toxic, Treehugger and Zebra Norns 2017 Jungle Grendels and Desert Ettins My TCR Norns |
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 BaffleBlend |
Already snagged them. Going to watch carefully how they stack up alongside their predecessors. |
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 bjw |
Just curious, does downloading these mean you have to overwrite the current versions you own of these breeds, or is there a way to have both? |
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 BlueLeafeon |
I tried a few wolfling runs with these, and generally found that the Norns would act as if they were full even when they were dying of a lack of a certain type of nutrition. I would blame mutation on that, except it seemed to be a pretty common thing with several different strains of Norns. (I had about 3-4 different groups of Norns in different metarooms) |
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Malkin Manager |
bjw wrote: There are egg agents for Muco and optional replacement genetics included. My TCR Norns |
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 Arnout |
Hey all! So far I'm very happy with how these turned out, and I recommend them to you all. I'm rolling out an update to improve play experiences with these overall. Download it here. Includes an update for the original genomes (New original genomes), as well as a patch for people that are using the 2017 egg agents. (New 2017 genomes) Put them in your Creatures 3 and Docking Station Genetics folders. There's also Starter Parents in the files with the latest changes. Details: - To promote crossbreeding, all breeds have a progesterone half life of 56 now. This should likely prevent all egg laying trouble in later generations with Treehugger crossbreeds, unless some of the genes mutate. This also means that after laying an egg, females require some more time until they can get pregnant again. - Some generation 1 Norns (mainly male Treehuggers and Bondis) refused to breed due to getting too crowded from approaching other Norns, so approaching other Norns no longer increases crowdedness perceptibly for all genomes. - I felt that the ChiChi breeds had unfair advantages over the classic Creatures 3 Norn Breeds, so I made the Bengal, Bruin and Civet immune to 2 lethal toxins. They now require less food as well. - Bondi Norns are immune to toxins that impede their breathing system, Hardman Norns are immune to toxins that reduce their energy and Treehugger Norns are immune to toxins that attack their digestive systems. Imo, bacteria in Creatures 3 stand-alone are ridiculously overpowered, and this helps your populations fight the infections. If this change stops any of you from downloading them though, I'd happily release a pack without the infection changes. BlueLeafeon wrote: That could very well be the result of a mutation. Were you playing with bacteria/toxins on by any chance? Hunger is emitted in the Floating Loci organ. It's a feeble organ and it's often one of the first organs that's destroyed when a Creature gets infected with antigen 6 and 5 too often. Other phenomena that you'll see is that they can't sleep anymore or that they stop feeling crowdedness/loneliness. |
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BlueLeafeon |
That could very well be the result of a mutation. Were you playing with bacteria/toxins on by any chance? Hunger is emitted in the Floating Loci organ. It's a feeble organ and it's often one of the first organs that's destroyed when a Creature gets infected with antigen 6 and 5 too often. Other phenomena that you'll see is that they can't sleep anymore or that they stop feeling crowdedness/loneliness. I generally use CAOS codes to completely kill every instance of bacteria in the game, since otherwise the bacteria commit genocide. (I then use an agent to restore them to the room where my toxic norns live, but that aside...) I would definitely agree that it was a mutation, but it seemed to happen almost consistently. If I knew what genes to edit, I'd set them to 0 mutation rate. |
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Arnout |
Mutations can do nasty things to Norns, so I wouldn't be surprised if they could impede hunger somehow. Still I think it's rather weird that it's so common in your worlds, as I've only seen it with sick Creatures myself! There's a total of 7 genes that can directly influence your Creatures' hunger gain. 6 of these are located in the Floating Loci organ, and one is in the CNS: Drive Lobe Support organ. Removing the mutation rate from these genes by setting the value to 0 or unticking "Mut." could certainly make these occurrences less common, if you'd prefer fixing it that way.  - The first gene in the first organ (Drive Lobe Support) is the Half-Lives gene. There's only one Half-Lives gene in each genome so you cannot miss it. - In the Floating Loci there are 3 hunger emitters, respectively one for each hunger type. However, these are unable to mutate naturally so no action is required here. - Each of the 3 hunger emitters are bound to a receptor gene in that same organ. Muscle Tissue, [loc 8] Glycogen [loc 25] and Adipose Tissue [loc 26]. These last 3 genes are in fact able to mutate so turning the mutations off in these could result in more efficient wolfing runs. |
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BlueLeafeon |
Okay, thank you so much! This should solve my problems. |
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Arnout |
I'm glad that I could be of your help. Let me know how they turn out. |
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BlueLeafeon |
It definitely seems to help prevent things from going horribly wrong later on. What I'm noticing, though, is that if the Norn is full of one type of hunger, they generally can't be bothered to eat another type even if they're dying of malnutrition. This makes no sense since the three types of hunger are handled separately, anyway. So even though the Norn is dying of a lack of protein, I can't get it to eat a fruit because it thinks it's full from eating those seeds/'food.' Not that much of a big deal in wolfing runs, though, where the population is usually pretty large enough to support a few Norns dying of stupidity. Can I ask if any changes were made to Magma Norns to make them stop being eternally cold? One reason I stopped raising them was because no matter what agents I use, no matter whether I put them in The Abyss or whatever, they're always complaining of cold. I know TWB Magma Norns exist, but I don't think they've been updated fully... |
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Thiefy |
My 2017 Astro norns look like Fallow norns for some reason? (I swear I get the strangest issues....) |
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 Lurhstaap |
Honestly, I'm feeling like you reduced the urge to eat a little too much. If I TELL them to eat, they eat, and they eat when first hatched, but otherwise, mine are all dying of starvation rather quickly. I am using an edited batch with the most basic "Dragon" edits imposed (flyerase, swimmerase, and carnivory using the 'ate an animal' stimulus and two reaction genes, so they can get all three nutrients from eating animals only.) These are great "pet" Norns, but they can't wolf AT ALL. It's possible my edits are part of the problem, but the older CFFs and TWBs never had this issue when I put "Dragon" edits into them. Beyond that, though, this is very interesting. Actually I'm kind of intrigued by the way that they're very functional so long as I'm around to nudge them now and then, but invariably die if I leave them to their own devices. I never did well at the 'pet Norn' style of play - I tended to wind up either with Norns who had no need of me whatsoever, or else Norns that were so stubborn and/or stupid that they didn't listen to anything I told them to do without a dozen repetitions. These guys snap to when given an order most of the time but are totally helpless on their own, even if given extraordinary agent help. As an example, I put a pair of Cupid's Halos on a male and female and went to bed... by the time I woke up they were OBSESSED with 'push gadget' and wouldn't do anything else. They hung out together, pushing those floating cameras back and forth, but didn't make a single egg in all that time. Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage" |
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 Intyalle |
BlueLeafeon wrote: That could very well be the result of a mutation. Were you playing with bacteria/toxins on by any chance? Hunger is emitted in the Floating Loci organ. It's a feeble organ and it's often one of the first organs that's destroyed when a Creature gets infected with antigen 6 and 5 too often. Other phenomena that you'll see is that they can't sleep anymore or that they stop feeling crowdedness/loneliness. I generally use CAOS codes to completely kill every instance of bacteria in the game, since otherwise the bacteria commit genocide. (I then use an agent to restore them to the room where my toxic norns live, but that aside...) I would definitely agree that it was a mutation, but it seemed to happen almost consistently. If I knew what genes to edit, I'd set them to 0 mutation rate. I think that's sometimes just a thing that happens... I've observed multiple worlds at this point with a certain 'trademark mutation' that kept popping up, even in separate genetic lines. Just... all the time. But in another world, no sign of that mutation, and instead a completely different one runs rampant. Also known as bab_5_freak from the old Gameware forums. |
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Lurhstaap |
Wow. That might be an insight into how the game generates mutations. I didn't think it was based on any such fixed variables like that. Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage" |
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Intyalle |
Yeah, neither did I XD And yet, my practice wolfing world mutated to have no tails repeatedly, in several different lineages. As in, several identifiable gen 2s all had the (or perhaps 'a') mutation that caused it, and by a few generations in, I basically only ever saw a tail if I introduced new gen 1s, and only for 2-3 gens before they, too, were gone. The next world, however, has retained their tails admirably. Instead, it was absolutely crawling with norns who walked with their pelvis constantly thrust forward XD Which was hilarious but, again, weirdly persistent and widespread. At least 2/3 of the population ended up like that, and it persisted for at least 30 generations. Also known as bab_5_freak from the old Gameware forums. |
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Malkin Manager |
But were they related, or did the same mutation crop up again and again? My TCR Norns |
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Intyalle |
It's harder to tell with the gait mutation, since it started at a slightly higher gen, but for the no-tail mutation, it was the same one again and again. Several different, unrelated gen 2s all had it - probably at least 1/3 of the second gen was without tails. Also known as bab_5_freak from the old Gameware forums. |
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Lurhstaap |
Now that's really strange. I wonder what that's about. It's a difficult thing to test for, too. I'll have to keep my eyes open to see if any of my worlds develop characteristic mutations. Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage" |
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Arnout |
Hey, thanks for your posts. The 2017 eating habits were something I wasn't completely satisified about yet. I'm currently testing a version that has more consequent eating habits and a more varied diet. Once I'm happy with them (and once I've converted the changes to all breeds) I'll upload them here. If there's anything else that stands out let me know. Edit: Lurhstaap wrote: Before I forget, can you tell me which basic genome you used for your Dragons? |
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Lurhstaap |
I used the Siamese, I think? One of the 'resprited Chichi' breeds, in any event. Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage" |
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Missmysterics |
I hatched two from the bengal genome and they seem to get lonely extremely quickly, I don't know what it is because so far the way their genome deals with it, (half life,receptor, stim,drive maintenence) looks to be the same as vanilla, maybe i'm imagiing things. |
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Arnout |
Thank you for pointing that out. Will look into it when I can. Something that I've noticed is that even though they get lonely they very rarely seek one another out. I'm still trying to figure out what the cause behind that could be. |
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Lurhstaap |
Check stimulus genes, and set it to 'approach it' on the ones that have to do with loneliness reduction and other Norns. Also check instincts. Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage" |
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